Should I Worry About....Alcohol [Archive] - Win2Win UK Horse Racing Forum

Ruby

11th August 2005, 19:42

Yes I am :)
I thought , despite the excitement of shouting..."that's my boss!!"....that it was a good programme, didn't dictate .."Thou shalt not drink" etc etc .
And perhaps if the new licensing laws come into play, Britain may grow up a bit and ditch the binge drinking culture. Of course when they do come into effect we will have a couple of months where everyone will go a bit daft and be like pigs at troughs...until they realise that actually you haven't got to throw as mch booze down your neck before closing time.
The other point that escapes a lot of people including me, is that you just sometimes don't realise exactly how much you do drink in a day/night/week....

piggy

11th August 2005, 20:19

these programmes should be banned, my wife made me work out how many units i had last week ;fire and now she's calling me an alcy, mind you living next door to a pub and the wife working nights doesn't help :D

bigcumba

11th August 2005, 20:26

we had a patient in the hospital last week who had supposedly drink 30 units of alcohol.... a fair old bit - around a bottle of whisky's worth..... enough to knock most folk for 6.... trouble is this lady was 94 years old :yikes:

piggy

11th August 2005, 20:32

1s 30 units a lot then thought that was average :yikes:

Ruby

11th August 2005, 20:36

Well Piggy, when you consider that the current recommended maximum alcohol intake for women per week is 14, and for men 21 per week...30 in one go for anyone, let alone a little old lady is....staggering...literally :D :yikes:

Ruby

11th August 2005, 20:59

People tend to think that because they may not fall into the "alcoholic" category, and they say they know when to stop drinking, that they are at little or no risk of liver problems. However, a lot of people may carry on drinking heavily for many years...i.e over the recommended limit, and feel fine. Until one day they find they are very sick after a small amount of alcohol, they are yellow and have swollen tummies and ankles and find they have severe cirrhosis of the liver. A bit of a late wake up call.
The amount of alcohol that can damage one person's liver may not necessarily have the same effect on another person's liver. So as with most medical things research is done to ascertain what is the ideal "safe" level.
Alcohol dependence affects any age , sex and all walks of life. There are even people as young as 25 with alcoholic liver disease.
I think the programme tonight just helped to open our eyes a little as to how much we may actually be drinking,how alcohol can affect us and how to take a bit more responsibility for our own health.

bigcumba

11th August 2005, 21:14

There are even people as young as 25 with alcoholic liver disease.

Working in the lab I see a lot of that.... must admit to having the begninnings of liver problems in my mid-late 20's as well, but then 8-10 pints a night from Thursday to Sunday was going to have some effect.... plus the odd all dayer on Saturdays and add in gigs and impromptu nights out, plus the lunchtime sessions.... it soon adds up to a whole lot of trouble. Luckily working in the lab also meant I was able to check my liver function blood results on a regular basis, so I could cut back as needed - my level of the main liver enzyme (called GGT) was 130, and normal should have been less than 45 - I got it back there within weeks. Was I an alcoholic - nope, I just liked to drink (still do!), and cutting back was easy. What a lot of folk don't realise - especially Sam's 4 cans a night mates, is that as well as limiting the amount you drink, it's also important to have alcohol free days as well - to give the old liver a rest. No more than a glass of wine on these 'off' days.

presto

11th August 2005, 21:20

i don't know if this is better or worse. but i only drink (binge drink) around once every 5 weeks or so. but when i do drink it will be an all day bender - 14:00 start 2:00 finnish drinking copious ammount's of alcohol. i don't touch alcohol inbetween.

Ruby

11th August 2005, 21:25

I agree Big C...I enjoy a drink myself , and when you're having fun and the alcohol makes you relax, it's very easy to have "just one more".
Another thing though is , if people are able to stick to their maximum weekly intake of alcohol units, they need to spread them over the week and not save them up for one big blow out every week. Or even not to drink for 3-4 weeks and then to go for it on a weekend bender as these are really bad for your liver!!...should say general health really..just edited this to put in this link if permitted....
http://www.bma.org.uk/ap.nsf/Content/physioeffechighalcointake

presto

11th August 2005, 21:26

:peeky

Ruby

11th August 2005, 21:26

GlosRFC

12th August 2005, 00:58

MMMmmmmm....Ruby in her nursey outfit :D :D

sparkyminer

12th August 2005, 02:04

MMMmmmmm....Ruby in her nursey outfit :D :D
Stuff the liver. I'm with you on this one Glos.:D

andyp

12th August 2005, 09:04

Do you work for the NHS Ruby or a private hospital?

Win2Win

12th August 2005, 09:32

Looks like Andy's wet the bed this morning, or his boyfriends chucked him out of the toilets :D

andyp

12th August 2005, 09:58

when we where lead in bed he told me he wanted a shower! how was i to know he didnt mean a golden one! :D

andyp

12th August 2005, 10:00

when we where lead in bed he told me he wanted a shower! how was i to know he didnt mean a golden one! :D

Anyway, what am i on about? :doh WHy have i suddenly become the win2win resident homosexual? :wink

vegyjones

12th August 2005, 10:00

when we where lead in bed he told me he wanted a shower! how was i to know he didnt mean a golden one! :D
are you roomies andy??

andyp

12th August 2005, 10:02

NAh, i think glynners has been dying to ask me to move in with him... but im happy with my girlfriend! I keep catching him eyeing me up at work..... :yikes: uh oh he's at it again!

Win2Win

12th August 2005, 10:10

Does your girlfriend know you have a secret lover :laugh

andyp

12th August 2005, 10:11

SSSHHH... its a secret :wink

susanwells

12th August 2005, 12:37

As usual., this thread has gone sideways. back to Ruiby`s original post. it is not only your liver. Binge drinkiing can affect your brain, your heart ..., not to mention you have a high chance oif having some sort of accident. Long term heavy drinking on a regular basis affects your liver, your brain, your heart and general cardio vascular system...your liver has remarkable powers of recovery if you give it a chance.. even once damaged. .. BUT there is a point of no return. It is also a nasty way to die.. whereas a moderate amount of alcohol has a protective effect on the CV system, too much makes you far more prone to heart attacks, high blood pressure and strokes.. we can all point to the person of 94 who drank a bottle a day just as we can all point to the person who smoked 100 a day and lived to be 100 but when nI was young and smoked, and also drank more than a female should, a doctor made an analogy I have never forgotten. You could, he said, put on a blindfold and walk across that busy high street now and by a fluke, dodge the traffic and reach the other side.. but the chances against your doing that are miniscule....your chances of being killed high.. so are you going to tell me it`s fine put on a blndfold and cross a busy high street ?
I gave up smoking 30 years ago, now don`t drink anything at all as the only drink i enjoyed regularly was red wine and I became seriously allergic to it..apart from a whisky if I have a bad cold, I now never drink. But point is, drinking is fine.. social, convivial, tastes nice, feel a glow, good for you in moderation.. and what I never understand is why people somehow cannot remember the word Moderation. I simply don`t see why people have not to drink, but drink to get drunk.. and make themselves ill, sick, prone to accidents, prone to die young..
Keith is so right... in 20 years time the hospitals are going to be full of people dying young from alcohol related disease and now that our life expectancy overall is immeasurably greater than it has ever been, it seems crazy that we self-inflict early death upon ourselves. :hearty

samantha1303

12th August 2005, 12:48

I watched Trauma - life in ER a couple of nights ago.
It was the hospital in Hawaii they were at.
All the serious trauma cases were alcohol related in some way every one of them.
People who had been drinking and crashed cars, or had other accidents - and a couple of people who were withdrawing from alcohol, one had the shakes so bad he fell and split his head open, they had to give him anti seizure medicine, and another man trying to give up alcohol stabbed himself straight in the chest with two massive carving knives they were stuck in right to the handle

Win2Win

12th August 2005, 12:58

..., not to mention you have a high chance oif having some sort of accidentI woke up in an ambulance twice during my 'fun' days!!!!!

My ex's brother was totally plastered on a bicycle last week and rode in front of a car, he is now in hospital for the next 2-3 weeks with a tube in his chest, one in his throat so he can breath, as part of his throat was crushed along with his voice box, and will need numerous ops. He's had 3 already, and half his voice box removed.

Couple of years back a friend of my dads came out of a pub, fell down the steps, fractured his skull, and died.

samantha1303

12th August 2005, 13:04

People do seem to be drinking alot more alcohol in this country now.
Everynight I can look out of my window and in a few hoursI would see at least 3 people wandering down the road who can hardly stand, one step forward 3 steps back then they stumble, hold onto a lampost and off they go again.
The large concerts and festivals that I have been to you have masses of people walking to the venue, and they are drinking from bottles of spirits.

vegyjones

12th August 2005, 13:20

Everynight I can look out of my window and in a few hoursI would see at least 3 people wandering down the road who can hardly stand, one step forward 3 steps back then they stumble, hold onto a lampost and off they go again.
You don't live near Mark, Tophatter and BigC do you?? :doh

samantha1303

12th August 2005, 13:29

:laugh

GlosRFC

12th August 2005, 15:09

There's no easy answer to alcohol abuse but there seems little doubt that our antiquated licensing laws are to blame. I'm not aware of a binge-drinking culture in other countries apart from the UK - this is encouraged primarily by the need some people feel to cram as much drink down themselves in the final half-hour before closing time. If someone gets ready to go out and arrives at the pub by nine, then they've only got 2 hours in which to purchase drink - so they'll try to swamp 10 pints down in that short period. In places where the licensing regulations are more relaxed, people go out later and have the option to drink the same quantity, but over a significantly longer period of time. In reality, they actually end up drinking less. If we ask a colleague if they'd like to go for a drink, that usually means a few rounds. If a German or American asks you to go for a drink they mean precisely that - one drink!

Scotland has had more liberal licensing laws that the rest of the UK for over 15 years and drink-related arrests have fallen. So too have drink-related diseases and injuries. The Netherlands introduced 24-hour licensing in 1987 and they too have seen a substantial reduction in drink-related crime.

There's no doubt that, when 24-hour licensing is introduced, some people will try to consume alcohol at the same rate, i.e. 5 pints per hour but they'll soon find out that they can't maintain it.

Merlin

12th August 2005, 17:48

With these new licensing laws there will most certainly be a difficult, worse binge drinking period (than at present) for up to a year.....

I rememeber very well when the Sunday licensing hours changed.........pubs used to be 12.00 till 2.00pm.......and open at 7.00pm at night.......this changed to 12.00 - 3.30pm, and eventually to all day....

The effect this had in primarily working class areas was that the guys were wearing their Sunday Luch on their head - or it ended up in the dog, coz the wifeys got peed off with having the Sunday lunch ready at 2.15pm - 2.30pm for husby to stroll in at 4.00pm.......:laugh

Win2Win

12th August 2005, 17:56

I used to stay in our pub on a Sunday all day before they changed the law....behind closed curtains....

tophatter

12th August 2005, 18:04

I cant believe some of the fuss people have tried to make about the licencing laws. Anyone who goes out know that the trouble flashpoints are at chucking out time, people coming out of the pubs at the same time, having gulped down two pints and a couple of chasers in 20 minutes when time was called.

Now think of every party you have been to. People start drifting away when they have had enough and by the time the "hardcore" are left there is hardly anyone left to agitate them. Sure there will be a novelty value at first but youngsters dont want to stay in pubs gone past midnight anyway - they want to go to clubs and dance - nightclubs in every town are open till three am anyway. These are open late anyhow and all that will happen is you will have less people milling around arguing about cabs and who is first in the kebab queue. Again the people who are most opposed to it are the right wing and yet they bang on about nanny state and saying people should have choice.

Merlin

12th August 2005, 18:05

I used to stay in our pub on a Sunday all day before they changed the law....behind closed curtains....

:yikes: Sure Keith - so did I, but as in most pubs, only the select few gets to have afters......when it was legal......all the ::swear::swear::swear::swear::swear::swears used to saty out too......:laugh

GlosRFC

12th August 2005, 18:43

The other advantage of 24-hour licencing that's frequently forgotten is that the police can spread their resources around. At the moment they need to have coppers standing by at Pub A, Pub B and Pub C at 11pm...but under the new law pubs are free to chose when they close. The police will have this information and can therefore have the same coppers standing by at Pub A for 11pm, Pub B at 12pm and Pub C at 2am.

TH touched one problem that is bound to surface - the lack of transportation in the early hours of the morning and so fights breaking out at taxi-ranks. When the Dutch introduced 24-hour licensing they solved this by making it a condition for bars and clubs opening after 2am to provide free "disco buses" to take people home.

sparkyminer

12th August 2005, 18:48

In Mansfield, 6th worst place to live in Britain apparently, they have the aforementioned buses. every hour, 12am, 1am, 2am, 3am, to the outlying villages. £3 fixed fare. Very popular.

Win2Win

12th August 2005, 19:10

In Mansfield, 6th worst place to live in Britain apparently....Strange one that, checking the records it was 53rd before you moved there :rolleyes:

sparkyminer

12th August 2005, 19:15

Oi. Leave it.:)

Onlyforfun

12th August 2005, 19:51

I'm not entirely convinced by your argumeny Glos.

1- there is binge drinking in the UK as we are descended from Celtic and Anglo-Saxon warriors who were well known for their binge drinking throughpout history

2- according to the programme last night the French have higher rates of Cirrhosis than the UK despite their "continental drinking habits"

3- Its not so long since Glasgow actually TIGHTENED its liscensing laws because of the amount of alcohol related trouble at weekends. This meant that clubs had to stp selling alcohol at around 1:30 am, not closing until 3 or 4 am, giving people a bit of time to sober up before leaving.

Its not as if you can't drink late anyway, there are plenty of bars, at least in the developed parts of Britain, that are open to the wee small hours, they just levy a cover charge. Surely if we were destined to behave, these would be havens of peace and tranquility? There are 2 pubs in Beckenham open until 2am and people are stupidly smashed and causing bother from them?

The problems are here to stay, I just think trouble spot pubs should have to pay higher rates for policing.

Win2Win

12th August 2005, 20:13

Instead of giving out Dole, we should just give them, beer instead :D

GlosRFC

12th August 2005, 20:22

I'm not entirely convinced by your argumeny Glos.

The proof of the pudding will be in the eating, no doubt :puke

However they're not just my arguments but the arguments of a number of people including the Adam Smith Institute.

sparkyminer

12th August 2005, 20:24

Ah, the Smith Institutes, nice family.:)

tophatter

12th August 2005, 20:27

If I knew the Adams family were in favour I would have argued against it!

susanwells

12th August 2005, 22:58

Do you know, for once I agree with the government..people will get bored and they will run out of money... once you`re allowed to do something and no one stops you any time for any reason, you get fed up with doing it.. when the supermarkets started to sell booze all hours they were open everyone predicted that people would be lying in the gutters, outside etc.. in fact the aisles where the drink is are always the emptiest except the week before christmas...and you never see anyone standing swigging from a bottle of booze outside Tesco ...
there will be more drunks on the streets on friday and saturday nights because there ALWAYS HAVE BEEN.. it`s pay night, party night, end of the week etc./.. that won`t change..but I think GLOS is right...
:hearty

tophatter

12th August 2005, 23:04

I did not think the Supermarkets could sell Booze after hours Susan - I think they cordon off that part of the supermarket. You are right though, just because things are available longer hours it dont mean people will automatically do it. If I want to go to the all night snooker club and have a few games of snooker, I can't have a beer or two. A lot of people work unsociable hours and might want to go somewhere like that after a night shift and have a beer or two. The world has changed. We are the 24 hours society, people are working different shift patterns and just like Sundays had to change so does these silly laws. We do not need nannying.

Merlin

12th August 2005, 23:14

Talking about drinking problems.....Having been the owner and licensee of 3 previous boozers - I believe that alcoholism is far more widespread than generally reported.....:yikes:

Lots and lots of people are alcholics and either never admit it or dont realise it.....:yikes:

I veiwed my time owning pubs as fun times - and I treated them as such........open almost 24 hours, particularly at weekends...

Opening longer didnt really increse the problems, coz when regulars realised I would be staying open all night......some used to arrive later......you are always gonna get the assholes who cant handle drinking , and I have seen many. many Jekyll and Hyde characters after too much booze.....:yikes:

I have a brother who is an hopless alcholic - and at only 38 years old already blleds from the rectum on an almost daily basis......:yikes:.....he will be extremely fortunate to see 2 more birthdays........

On balance, in the long term (however, there will be short term abuse) I dont feel extended licensing hours will increase alcoholism or acohol related problems......coz they have always been there , and will always be there......:yikes:

The only 2 serious ways to reduce the negative effects of alcohol is through education and self realisation.........

However, it will always be too late for some people....and some people will always drink too much.......but at the end of the day......they have to make the choice......and more importantly perhaps - the government should give people the choice.....which is what in fact they are doing.....:yikes:

tophatter

12th August 2005, 23:22

Yep agree with all that Merl. Alcoholics dont sit drinking fosters in the pub, they buy the hard stuff cheap from the supermarkets and drink it for breakfast. That problem will always exist whilst alchol is legally sold., same as smoking and lung cancer. Education about the damage it does to your health and trying to make it unfashionable is the only way it can be curbed - but at the end of the day people are free to make the choice, it is the only pratical way.

If you shut every pub down in the country there would still be people fighting, damaging their health and been a nuisance through booze. The current laws just create a half hour spell of lunacy at kicking out time

Workshy

12th August 2005, 23:27

tophatter

12th August 2005, 23:32

Merlin

12th August 2005, 23:33

Alot of aggression thats put down to drinking comes from people taking cocaine. Never seems to be associated in these discussions yet is one of the main factors of the 'high'. Not had it myself but seen enough of my mates on it, aswell as people I know.

Agree Worky - and this area is a really big problem........I used to have to ban people.......who seemed under the influence of drugs............and I aint scared of much.....but have been in some scary situations throwing these guys out the boozer........:yikes:

tophatter

12th August 2005, 23:35

I used to have to ban people.......who seemed under the influence of drugs............:

We have had to do that on here once or twice too! :laugh

Workshy

12th August 2005, 23:40

yep, A lot of the football hoolies take that stuff now. Now you see we are getting into murky waters now because Cocaine is freely available, almost condoned and expected to be took in certain circles. Now as people have got more money and the drug has come down in price it has gone to the masses. Maybe that should be legalised and strictly controlled because is it any more damaging than Nicotine or alcohol? I dont think it should but if people are taking now as commonly as having a beer it is a problem that wont go away just by saying its illegal

When I went to a football match, I was with (but not involved with) some ultra's/hoolies. One of them took 80grams to the game for "the boys". There wasnt even 80 of them!

Also used to know a Liverpool fan (hoolie) and he was always on the sniff for games. 8 stellas, a lady bottle of vodka & some sniff is some cocktail for a Saturday away game!

Crazy.

silax

13th August 2005, 11:34

hmmmm
i like drinking i like getting drunk i don't have a problem with it.
the uk problem won't fix itself for a few generations at least and i don't think its down to the hours the bars open.
Its more down to the people then anything else. i've been there done it and got the t-shirt in the uk like most of the people on the forum. would longer hours have stopped me getting drunk nope maybe i would have been sick a bit later in the night.
i'm living in a spanish town and early in the week the bars close at 9:30 well most of them and you don't see people rushing to get there last few pints in.
the main difference is the people drinking you can sit in a bar area with clubs and discos and get a complete mixture of generations famillies with young children teenagers in and out of clubs old age pensinors sitting around. i was there with friends till 3 am last night no trouble juat people enjoying themselves.
its up to everybody in the uk to turn the culture round and make drinking areas more user friendly. i personally think its too far gone now and will only get worse.